<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: The expense of end of life care</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.medrants.com/archives/4095/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.medrants.com/archives/4095</link>
	<description>Contemplating medicine and the health care system</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 17 Mar 2010 23:16:37 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: Physician disability quote</title>
		<link>http://www.medrants.com/archives/4095/comment-page-1#comment-524430</link>
		<dc:creator>Physician disability quote</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Feb 2009 19:45:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.medrants.com/?p=4095#comment-524430</guid>
		<description>Sad but true, good points here. Many families want to provide long term care for their loved ones, but are rarely prepared for it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sad but true, good points here. Many families want to provide long term care for their loved ones, but are rarely prepared for it.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Janemarie</title>
		<link>http://www.medrants.com/archives/4095/comment-page-1#comment-524405</link>
		<dc:creator>Janemarie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Feb 2009 21:15:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.medrants.com/?p=4095#comment-524405</guid>
		<description>TBTAM points to one way that we might decrease the costs near the end of life:  support good primary care for the elderly.  I have a number of frail elderly patients who are quite willing to forgo specialty consultations and procedures, after a discussion of the risks versus benefits, with the former often being greater than the latter for them.  The key to this is a good relationship between the doctor, patient, and patient&#039;s family.  Sadly, this is available to but a shrinking part of our society today.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>TBTAM points to one way that we might decrease the costs near the end of life:  support good primary care for the elderly.  I have a number of frail elderly patients who are quite willing to forgo specialty consultations and procedures, after a discussion of the risks versus benefits, with the former often being greater than the latter for them.  The key to this is a good relationship between the doctor, patient, and patient&#8217;s family.  Sadly, this is available to but a shrinking part of our society today.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: GingerB</title>
		<link>http://www.medrants.com/archives/4095/comment-page-1#comment-524404</link>
		<dc:creator>GingerB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Feb 2009 18:25:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.medrants.com/?p=4095#comment-524404</guid>
		<description>I think focusing on a comfortable and dignified death is probably going to go down better than talking about the expense. 

If you start reading about what it&#039;s like to work someplace where the patients are on ventilators and all the things they do to keep the patients from diconnecting themselves you begin to get a sense of how awful it must be for the so-called &quot;loved one.&quot; 

Maybe they could license the Sting song &quot;If you love someone set them free&quot; for a public health message.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think focusing on a comfortable and dignified death is probably going to go down better than talking about the expense. </p>
<p>If you start reading about what it&#8217;s like to work someplace where the patients are on ventilators and all the things they do to keep the patients from diconnecting themselves you begin to get a sense of how awful it must be for the so-called &#8220;loved one.&#8221; </p>
<p>Maybe they could license the Sting song &#8220;If you love someone set them free&#8221; for a public health message.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: on the fence</title>
		<link>http://www.medrants.com/archives/4095/comment-page-1#comment-524397</link>
		<dc:creator>on the fence</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Feb 2009 08:56:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.medrants.com/?p=4095#comment-524397</guid>
		<description>First I must preface that I am a physician who feels the greatest part of the American Dream so to speak is self determination.

I do not want our country adopting a UK NIH like stance that once a patient engages in non covered care, all care is denied. I want  a system that enables a [financially] capable patient of purchasing whatever &quot;appropriate&quot; care is desired. On the other hand I believe our duty as a physicain is to inform them openly and honestly of the likely futility of such care, anything else would IMHO be malpractice.

Insurance policies should have different rate tiers that address the policies coverage for various EOL senarios and when the proverbial [financial] plug is pulled. Once that theshold is passed, the patient/estate would become responsible for payments, and have to pony up some collateral to continue such care.

This would obviously require some overhaul of Medicare but hey it needs overhaul anyway.

I feel the ultimate decision should be that of the patient, who
should bear the responsibility for payment of such care. If grandma or granddad wants to bet the house [kids inheritance] prolonging their life [or is it death] who are we to deny them.

On the otherhand if they wish to spend other peoples money then other people should have a say and deny such spending when deemded inappropriate.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First I must preface that I am a physician who feels the greatest part of the American Dream so to speak is self determination.</p>
<p>I do not want our country adopting a UK NIH like stance that once a patient engages in non covered care, all care is denied. I want  a system that enables a [financially] capable patient of purchasing whatever &#8220;appropriate&#8221; care is desired. On the other hand I believe our duty as a physicain is to inform them openly and honestly of the likely futility of such care, anything else would IMHO be malpractice.</p>
<p>Insurance policies should have different rate tiers that address the policies coverage for various EOL senarios and when the proverbial [financial] plug is pulled. Once that theshold is passed, the patient/estate would become responsible for payments, and have to pony up some collateral to continue such care.</p>
<p>This would obviously require some overhaul of Medicare but hey it needs overhaul anyway.</p>
<p>I feel the ultimate decision should be that of the patient, who<br />
should bear the responsibility for payment of such care. If grandma or granddad wants to bet the house [kids inheritance] prolonging their life [or is it death] who are we to deny them.</p>
<p>On the otherhand if they wish to spend other peoples money then other people should have a say and deny such spending when deemded inappropriate.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: country solo doctor</title>
		<link>http://www.medrants.com/archives/4095/comment-page-1#comment-524391</link>
		<dc:creator>country solo doctor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 22 Feb 2009 01:57:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.medrants.com/?p=4095#comment-524391</guid>
		<description>Hospice has been very helpful in helping patients and families.  The dying patient has a comfortable and dignified death.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hospice has been very helpful in helping patients and families.  The dying patient has a comfortable and dignified death.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Christian Sinclair</title>
		<link>http://www.medrants.com/archives/4095/comment-page-1#comment-524370</link>
		<dc:creator>Christian Sinclair</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Feb 2009 05:09:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.medrants.com/?p=4095#comment-524370</guid>
		<description>Medical Futility is a great blog and was up for a Weblog Award from Medgadget.  I highly recommend it.

The difficulty in determining futility cases is that the bar is usually set pretty high to really determine &#039;no positive outcome&#039; and of course you begin to have all sorts of issues with relative biases towards quality of life. 

I think many people are missing the key ingredient in more effective medicine and it has to do with the foundation of all medical decision making and all medical futility cases.

And that is the skill of prognostication.  How we as medical professionals estimate/formulate likely medical outcomes plays a huge role in what doctors and patients eventually choose to do.  And I am not talking about just how we communicate.  No medical school focuses on how to formulate a prognosis, nor do we as a medical system have a method to check if our estimates our correct.  

Of course any estimation of accuracy in predicting likely outcomes is open to recall bias, anchoring bias, and many other cognitive biases.  I think more than comparative effectiveness research, we need intense research into how doctors and patients categorize risk and benefit and therefore formulate a likely future medical outcome. 

(And outcome is not considered to be just life or death, but resolution of infections after antibiotics, or time until independent function after traumatic brain injury)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Medical Futility is a great blog and was up for a Weblog Award from Medgadget.  I highly recommend it.</p>
<p>The difficulty in determining futility cases is that the bar is usually set pretty high to really determine &#8216;no positive outcome&#8217; and of course you begin to have all sorts of issues with relative biases towards quality of life. </p>
<p>I think many people are missing the key ingredient in more effective medicine and it has to do with the foundation of all medical decision making and all medical futility cases.</p>
<p>And that is the skill of prognostication.  How we as medical professionals estimate/formulate likely medical outcomes plays a huge role in what doctors and patients eventually choose to do.  And I am not talking about just how we communicate.  No medical school focuses on how to formulate a prognosis, nor do we as a medical system have a method to check if our estimates our correct.  </p>
<p>Of course any estimation of accuracy in predicting likely outcomes is open to recall bias, anchoring bias, and many other cognitive biases.  I think more than comparative effectiveness research, we need intense research into how doctors and patients categorize risk and benefit and therefore formulate a likely future medical outcome. </p>
<p>(And outcome is not considered to be just life or death, but resolution of infections after antibiotics, or time until independent function after traumatic brain injury)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: TBTAM</title>
		<link>http://www.medrants.com/archives/4095/comment-page-1#comment-524364</link>
		<dc:creator>TBTAM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Feb 2009 18:23:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.medrants.com/?p=4095#comment-524364</guid>
		<description>I continually thank god for the wisdom of my family, who acted with compassion and common sense when my 80-some year old grandmother had a massive stroke. She had been telling us for over a year that she was ready whenever god decided to take her -she had had a good life, but now her heart was not what it had been and she could no longer do all the things she loved to do. When the stroke happened, her family doctor, who had known her for years, gave her an IV for hydration and a little nasal O2, all her children and grandchildren came and we all held her hand and stood vigil by her bedside as she died that night. It was as peaceful and happy a death as we could have imagined, other than her dying in her sleep.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I continually thank god for the wisdom of my family, who acted with compassion and common sense when my 80-some year old grandmother had a massive stroke. She had been telling us for over a year that she was ready whenever god decided to take her -she had had a good life, but now her heart was not what it had been and she could no longer do all the things she loved to do. When the stroke happened, her family doctor, who had known her for years, gave her an IV for hydration and a little nasal O2, all her children and grandchildren came and we all held her hand and stood vigil by her bedside as she died that night. It was as peaceful and happy a death as we could have imagined, other than her dying in her sleep.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Dr. Bob (FP)</title>
		<link>http://www.medrants.com/archives/4095/comment-page-1#comment-524362</link>
		<dc:creator>Dr. Bob (FP)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Feb 2009 17:47:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.medrants.com/?p=4095#comment-524362</guid>
		<description>We have a saying that guilt is proportional to the distance lived from mom or dad, and these kids are extremely demanding about what they think should be done.  Often times they demand things that neither I or the kid that has been taking care of mom or dad want.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We have a saying that guilt is proportional to the distance lived from mom or dad, and these kids are extremely demanding about what they think should be done.  Often times they demand things that neither I or the kid that has been taking care of mom or dad want.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Topics about Health, Food and Well being &#187; Archive &#187; The expense of end of life Bcare/B</title>
		<link>http://www.medrants.com/archives/4095/comment-page-1#comment-524360</link>
		<dc:creator>Topics about Health, Food and Well being &#187; Archive &#187; The expense of end of life Bcare/B</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Feb 2009 14:36:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.medrants.com/?p=4095#comment-524360</guid>
		<description>[...] SiberNews Media placed an observative post today on The expense of end of life Bcare/BHere&#8217;s a quick excerpt&#8230;challenge here.  We cannot pay for ever possible Bhealth/B Bcare/B expense.  We must make choices.  Dollars spent on futile Bcare/B could be spent&#8230; [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] SiberNews Media placed an observative post today on The expense of end of life Bcare/BHere&#8217;s a quick excerpt&#8230;challenge here.  We cannot pay for ever possible Bhealth/B Bcare/B expense.  We must make choices.  Dollars spent on futile Bcare/B could be spent&#8230; [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
